How a Black Man Feels He is Portrayed and Received in American Culture

Thank you for tuning in to Healing Race. In this video, I share with Todd the ways I've seen black people portrayed by leaders and in the media and the messages it sends about black people. Andre and I also discuss how black and white behaviors and views can be misinterpreted and misunderstood and the challenges that can create for racial relationships. So let's get to that conversation. Enjoy. If there are cultural differences racially, ethnically, in in expressing oneself in different way. Right? So you can have the same emotion. You can have the same goal, but you might express yourself differently because of what you learned in your cultural community. Sometimes cultural difference can feel unnerving. Like, it could feel scary not because the person is scary, but because the environment is different. Yes. And I understand. So if you're not I you know, we can even go beyond race or ethnicity. Like, if someone came from a family where yelling at each other, you know, was common, and then someone else came from a family where you didn't do that. And then all of a sudden, they're with their in laws, and that's the way you do it. I've had that personal experience. Yeah. That could be jarring. It's like, how do I deal with this situation? You know? Like, when my family yells, they're angry. Right? Yes. But when you're angry when your family yells, they're just communicating. Yeah. For real. I remember I was like, uh-oh. Like, it's what's going on here? I so I take your point. I do because I've had that was a very tangible example of that. I've had that experience. Yeah. So, you know, if there are cultural differences, sometimes the meaning given isn't completely contrived by, like, the news media environment. Sometimes it's based on their actual experience in their culture. Yeah. Of how these behave what these behaviors mean. That is very, very valid, but you one must be very self-aware that your culture or let's what familial culture and the larger race is a lens by which you show up. And you should always something that I, I guess, evolve to sort of consider is understanding the rules of engagement vis a vis the lens that I'm looking at something. Right? And that helps me guide that helps form, help me form an understanding of what's going on or what I perceive to be going on. I think all of that takes a lot of self-awareness. Yeah. So what you're basically saying is, okay. I understand that people will have instinctive reactions to a different culture based on what they have grown in. So take this example of the yelling, or speaking loudly, let's say. Yes. If I experience that as someone being angry in the way that I've grown up, but others do it differently. I might have an instinctive reaction, and you can recognize and acknowledge that makes sense. Like, we're all timid. And let's run with that. And let's run with that. So and talk about race. So black people are brought up to be very demonstrative people. Like, when you're timid and black people pick on you, they really do. Like, we're I mean, you see it all over black Twitter. We're very demonstrative people. And that means raise your voice, get animated, even about happy things. I have literally been in restaurants just because I was happy to see a friend and people thought I was being loud and obnoxious. And I was like, I'm just being animated. Right? Mhmm. And then that's when I started to become conscious of rules of engagement vis a vis my lens kind of shit. Because it's like, okay, let me calibrate myself to make sure I'm operating successfully in this environment. And I had to learn that because of white people. I literally did. And it was a little bit against what I know in my culture because in my culture, you're not we're not we don't sit. White people don't sit quietly at a dinner shoot. We talk. We don't just sit down. We don't that is not how you know. If you ever came to my mama's house, you need to be demonstrable. Like, oh, this is good, girl. Like, we are demonstrative people. And just sitting there quiet because I used to be that quiet kid, and I was picked on all the time. And I learned I'm like, Andre, you better speak up. And then I learned to run around white people. I learned, Andre, you too loud. So I learned, you know, white folks just wanna sit there What who are you supposed to be, essentially? Exactly. And do you see this? Yes. It's that's the perfect way to put it. Who am I supposed to be? Now I'm a middle-aged man now, so I've learned to read the situations quickly. But 20 years ago but when I was young and starting in career and, you know, making cross cultural friends, starting to really make friends with white people. What if I had to learn how to, you know, adjust myself or I'll be perceived in a way that I wasn't that was not my intention? Does that make sense? Mhmm. Mhmm. So I there's so you talked about having the lens of someone else's culture. There's kind of two ways, right, that we we've been talking about. You've talked about adjusting to culture. Mhmm. Then you also brought up the need to let someone be themselves and come to understand the lens of their own culture Yes. That you don't assume things about them Mhmm. And you understand a little bit better that their motivations might be different than what you think they are Yes. Based on the way they're communicating. And that that sounds it's just like such a dance. Right? Because, like, well, we just, like, meet in the middle somewhere or it's, you know, some adjusting of the way that I present to you maybe because I know that you have a certain reaction, but then you understanding a little bit if I present myself, if I approach our conversation in a different way, you understanding, okay. Well, he doesn't mean this in his culture or the way he grew up Mhmm. That meant something different. Even at work. So even in my professional life, I've learned to tone down the passion because the passion could like, woah. This guy is off the rail. Like, white peep white people are very, very different like that. Like, you all don't like, I could be talking about I'm not gonna talk about work project or something. And if I'm speaking too passionately, I noticed they're not they're having a really drawn reaction to what I'm saying. Is that what angry? I'm like, no. I'm just communicating. Like, I mean, once I was in a meeting recently, and I said, no one knows what's going on in that business over there. And, you know, I'm not I'm bringing up a truth whenever we need something done. No one knows what to do. And but I've had to learn to not be so truthful, not be so honest or learn how to I mean, you know, phrasing is very important to white people. And since black people largely have been used to help make white people feel comfortable with themselves, it's a dance I'm adept at doing now. But I even in my middle age, I still am mindful of what I could be imparting, if I if I'm not if I'm not abiding by the rules of engagement in a particular context. So well, so, like, that example, like, how would you know if how would you know? So the example of no one knows what's going on in that business over there. Mhmm. What's the reaction that you get that makes you feel like you're being taken a different way than what your intention is? You see the nervousness on people's faces. So none of my teammates displayed nervousness, but as me and as listening as I speak and then, being mindful of the emotions I'm conveying while I'm speaking in a meeting, then I chastise myself for being a little bit too truthful in saying that. But I mean so the nervousness really didn't happen in that instance, but I've seen it before. The nerve there there's a nervousness or you usually, it's a white man that wants to step in and be the authority. Now hold on. Come on. On. And then and I just white men love to be authority for my god. They know every goddamn thing in life. I swear. And I'm telling you, if it comes out of the mouth of a white man, it is automatically gospel. I'm not saying that white men aren't smart, but I have that that's one way that is a surefire sign that when you are stepping outside of the rules of engagement, a white man will say something to kinda reign you in or contradict your thought. So there's a couple things there. One is in terms of people getting nervous when you say something again, like, no one knows what's going on in the business over there. How does one know how you would know that that is a or maybe it doesn't matter at the end of the day, you're just getting the reaction that you do, then that is a reaction based on race versus based on discomfort. Not necessarily race, but my point is that is are the cultural the cultural differences and that and thank you for bringing this up and asking this question. Because in one of the things maybe you picked up for me, black people are also brought up to be very direct. Like and it starts with our parents. When black parents speak to their children, you fucking know what's going on. I'm like, sorry for my expletive, but you know what's going on. Right? Yeah. You know, and that's something that we bring, let's say, that to the workplace. So I am a direct at least I try to be a direct person. You know, when you communicate sometimes, especially in a business setting too directly, people can take offense to that. And so especially when it's coming from a black person or another minority. So I've learned that I should air on the side of softening my language to make it more palatable so that the idea or the feedback is can be that much more accepted. Yeah. So you just yeah. You hit it right on kinda where I was thinking, which is, is this like a general tendency toward conflict avoidance in our in our culture? Right? Because I Know that black people don't avoid conflict, we are raised in conflict. The reason it affects black people to the degree that it does is because this is generally, you know, obviously, with exceptions, a cultural way of being. And if the culture generally is conflict avoidant, then it will affect you That has been my experience with white people. I've noticed white people avoid direct conflict, and I was not and me and my black friends, and I can tell they were kinda raised similarly. We are we are inculcated. You lean into conflict. Because to lean out of it seems timid as though the person can get the best of you. So now you and also, it's perceived as not standing up for yourself and lacking dignity among black people. So with black people, no, you lean into conflict. Mhmm. So I'm hearing kind of voices in my head of what I would imagine some responses would be to this idea. You said something specifically about white people care a lot about words. Right? Or phrasing. I think I think you said phrasing. And my guess is that there would be a lot of white people who would say, at least in today's world, they feel very uncomfortable about their own phrasing and their own ability to say anything that might be even tangential to the concept to the to the topic of race. Right? For fear of saying something that might trip some wires. Right? And I have a very direct response to that. It was your very direct response. My direct response is you don't have to worry as long as your comments come from a place of empathy. But if you come from a place if you if your comments are coming from a motivation of judgment, well, who wouldn't be? You know? And then you're like, well, why are they reacting that way? Well, look at what you're saying. You know? Like I said, to circle back, how may another person view this situation? You know? So, yeah, direct, but direct doesn't mean loveless. We're black people are direct, but it's usually it's coming from a place of love. Like, let's say, that outfit ain't working for you. Like, I'm trying to help you out because you're running around here looking crazy. That's not me just criticizing your style. I'm just saying you may wanna rethink what you have on. You know what I mean? I'm just giving you a common comedic example, but it's an example of being direct, but you're not you're not trying to, you know, denigrate a person. You're you can be direct and still come from a place of empathy and love. And, you know, and, also, we have different communication styles. I get that. Yeah. But I think human beings have the same basic cadre of motivations if you will. Yeah. Yeah. I guess where I'm coming from is, you know, I actually think they're funny enough, I think there could be there there's actually a sense of common human ground in this. I'll give you I'll give you kind of a more provocative example because it builds off of the commentary in, from our last episode. And it is when we talked about the idea of a victim mentality. Mhmm. Right? And how there is often a perception among some quarters in the United States that to speak about racial inequities, the issue of racial inequities and kind of a desire to mend those inequities that, that that that basically comes from some kind of victim mentality. Like, woe is me. I'm a black person. Like, I need extra help, so forth and so on. Right? And I extra help, so forth and so on. Right? And I could imagine someone who might have an approach to inequities, communicating, saying almost the exact same things as you just said to me. So here's what I could imagine them saying. Well, I am coming from a place of love. I actually think one of the most loving things to say is to focus on the issue of personal responsibility and the need to focus on oneself and how does one take advantage of the opportunities that do exist. Right? The kind of tough love. Right? I could imagine someone saying that that comes from a place of love, and that even though we come off oh, let me just finish this one thought. That even if because I wanna connect it I wanna connect it to, something you said, this idea of coming off as harsh or coming off as angry, right, or coming off as judgmental, right, that that the surface of how someone might hear your words might be different than the intention that you have. And I could imagine them saying that. I can imagine them saying, yes. I know that that's tough. I know it comes off as harsh, but I also think it's for the best. I think I'm actually communicating something really important that in the end will be beneficial. So I just could imagine someone saying the same thing and worrying about having that kind of approach to life and policy, worry about communicating and the words that they use even if they might really feel in their heart of hearts that they're coming that that they come from a place of empathy. And what I would respond to that, where the way I respond is I feel black people would accept that feedback, that analysis, that perspective as long as it acknowledges the other part of the pie. So personal accountability is a very important part to one's elevation and success and, you know, and just the trajectory of one's life. But you also have to acknowledge that we individually don't always control everything. And what that means is there is still some systemic institutionalism, institutionalized racism that does prohibit a large number of Americans, black Americans from taking part of that. So no one is saying no. Because I think I think no one is saying that you should not be personally accountable for your own situation. That is something that is just part of manifest destiny in human and largely in United States culture. However, you have to also speak to the other part of the pie. So if you're gonna give if you're going to supply feedback or have a perspective, not don't just have a perspective on one side and characterize that. Look at the entire thing. And that's all anyone from a social justice motivation is asking. No one is saying, you know, like, you know, like, oh, not to be personally accountable, but look at the entire and then and there is a lot of systemic and institutionalized bias in our country. And not even just about race. I mean, more than anything, it's about class. Look at look at credit scores. Minorities tend to have lower credit scores, for example, than white people. Who do you think create who do you think creates the credit algorithm that that takes all this metadata about oneself and writes you like that? There's a there's all sorts of bias in all these different things. So talk about the whole thing. People are willing to accept your feedback and even and given harsh feedback that's given in love, but also acknowledge the other part of the pie. Yeah. And so that's kind of where you were coming from when you were saying empathy. Like, empathy is not just a feeling. Empathy is an action. It's a set of actions where you where you seek, where you get curious and you seek to understand where someone might be coming from and what is the other half of the pie is, as you say. And then it becomes more palatable to hear your half of the pie. Right? Or what's the critiques or suggestions that you advise, or I chuckle because what's the saying? A spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down? Right. Oh, shit. Give me some sugar shit. So coming back to what will provoke this conversation in the, you know, in the episode, the basic premise is how would you want to be seen as a black person, or how would you want the black community to be seen? And it was that that you're a community of love. Right? And so the foundation of this conversation is the idea that there are missing perceptions about the black community because the way in which the black community has been portrayed. Right? Yes. Like, I deeply find it personally offensive when white people don't feel that we are patriotic. Just so critiquing the country does not mean we lack patriotism. What it means is maybe some of us actually sat down and read the constitution and analysis of the founding fathers. And maybe in our critique, we're trying to help the country further realize its dream. Right? And that's deeply offensive, especially since so many minorities, so many people of color go into the US military. Like, we all of us who are, African American have someone in some in our family, you know somebody who's been who served. Right? And so to paint the oh, that's so that is so offensive to say that we are not patriotic just because we wanna hold the nation and the dream and the constitution and the people who claim to serve in that damn accountable. That's preposterous. Absolutely. It's offensive. And that had those deals with the concept of love too because this is about love of country. Right? Yes. To say that we don't love our country. Have love for your fellow humans and your fellow citizens, but you also have love for the country itself as well. And black people are laying down their lives all over the world in the name of the United States military and serving the constitution to help make sure that white races have their freedom. Mhmm. I swear to God. Do you think do you think that there is ever a hesitation within some portion of the black community, to, I guess, acknowledge the great parts of the country as they critique. So whereas you would where you have a challenge in people not being willing to listen to the critique. Right? Who might only wanna focus on how great America is and has been. Right? I see where you're going. Do you think do you think there is hesitation? And I'm not saying that's a bad thing, by the way. I'm just from a factual point of view and from an emotional point of view, is there a hesitation to say both sides of the pie? Talking about the other part of the pie. I understand we don't Right. It's like, you know I'm hungover. Needs to improve this. America needs to improve this. Yes. America has been great in x, y, and z ways, but we also have to do this. Is there hesitation about that? Yes. America has been great in this in these ways because maybe it, like, steals from the message of the critique. I don't know. No. I say there is there is no hesitation. And, okay. Not to speak in absolutes. There may be some hesitation, but, however, black people have still made great strides since the 1st day we landed in this place. And we will acknowledge that. Right? I mean, we've had I mean, just the I mean, I don't even wanna talk about celebrities, just the stunning success of so many, you know, black people who have been educated, who have PhDs, who are educators, who are been innovators at all throughout history. Mhmm. And we know that that's possible because we live in a country that allows us to be curious and to explore. So there probably are some who are hesitating to talk about the other part of the pie as I like to put as I put it. However, I think largely many black people will acknowledge the positives that exist in this country. But sometimes the negatives are just so negative, you become disenchanted with the positive. You know? Like but sometimes And, you know, people are we're not logical. We're emotional. We're like, what, 90% water or whatever. So our message, our emotions are always changing. You know? But, you know, we will accept that part of the analysis that says, look at the positive things the United States has done. Yeah. But that doesn't mean we're finished with the project. The project is one of perpetual evolution that we're all accountable for. To me, actually, in some degree, we're all serving the constitution by voting because the terms are coming up that I'm always there. The first day of early voting, I'm in line. You know? I mean, that's but that's my way of serving the constitution. You know, they say, you know what? I mean, that's we all serve it, and we all have a responsibility to it. And I think, tacit in that document, we all have a duty to respect one another while serving it. Mhmm. You know? So you feel you clearly have a lot of feeling around this issue of how the black community is sometimes cast with regard to patriotism. Mhmm. And that kind of is in line with one of the questions I wanted to ask, which is, can you give me a sense of you talk about you want the black community to see to be seen as a community of love. You feel like you're not always portrayed that way. What has been your experience over time in terms of how you have seen black people portrayed? So one is this issue of, like so one is this issue of patriotism. But I don't really have I guess right now; I'm trying to get a sense of the experience of what it's like to be Andre as a as a black man in in in the United States. And is this something you just see constantly in the news or and have throughout your life? Is it something that you just see in certain pockets? And, like, what are you actually seeing visually? And what are you hearing through pop culture, through the news, or whatever media streams you take in that that have portrayed the black community in a way that that had an effect on you. Look at conservative news outlets, and it's not an insinuation. Like, conservative news outlets are deliberately saying they are are deliberately casting a picture that that black people are somehow are this sinister cabal trying to take over the country and get all and get free checks and make the country lazy and all these other different things. So that we that by our very being is antithetical to the vow to American values. That is, oh lord, that they are deliberately casting that pitch that picture. Right? And, also, to not discount the, quote, unquote, liberal media, they, with their over coverage or, you know, their coverage of, you know, of all the benefits the government should be giving you, makes it seem where people have just give me give me give me give me give me. You know? And I if you I hold both sides accountable of finding some sort of medium. Right? Because they both feed into the into that sort of story of minority as victim and then minority as taker, minority as lazy, all these different things. So I'm seeing it from both sides. And the liberal and the conservative news outlets, they're casting you when you're just a person who wants a fair shot at what this, quote, unquote, American dream is. You know? Because I was talking thinking about, you know, Guillermo and people that I know overseas. And I'm like, what is this dream? I'm like, if this amazes it to come own a home and live in a suburb and have mountains of debt because you bought that home. Is it coming to Guillermo. Also to get rich? Guillermo, just so to know, is your fiancé. He lives in Costa Rica. So just to give people a sense of who Guillermo is. So you're thinking about the 2 of you, and he lives in Costa Rica, and you live in the United States, and you're thinking about where to live and spending time in America. And, and so you need to think about what America is. What It led me to start thinking about what I'm what is this dream? Because, you know, is there a Costa Rican dream in there to find out there actually is. Every country has some version of that. Right? And I was just thinking, trying to tangibly understand what it what does it really mean for you, for us in this country, and people who want to come live here. But yeah. You know, I lost my train of thought, but that that what I'm seeing is that casting, that casting as victim, that casting as manipulator, that casting is somehow in some way trying to get over on the United States and not work as hard or contribute our fair share. And number 1, that's all a mischaracterization. People are variable, so you may have some people who are behaving in that way. And then you probably have most people who are just trying to lead honest lives and have honest jobs, etcetera. Right? And the language is always crafted as though it makes it feel as though that I like, all the people in this group have this motivation, and that's just not true. So, I mean, if you want a sense of what it's like to be me from a political perspective, that’s what it is. I mean, it’s basically people think you're disengaged, uninformed. I've even had someone once asked me. I was talking about a frivolous topic, and I did. It was a white man. What I tell you, say, white men always think they know everything. They truly, truly do. And the white dude asked me, Andre, who's the speaker of the house? And I named the speaker of the house, and then he was shocked that I because remember, I'm black. I'm supposed to be an idiot. Literally. People think the worst things about us. What even led to him asking you that question? Because he felt that that my converse the topic of conversation was frivolous. I don't even remember what I was talking about, but it was something very lighthearted, which is what you do in bars. But anyway and I remember that. And I guess it was it was an attempt to try to shame me. And then later, the same person told me how impressed he was with me, like, I think, oh, you know that I mean, I when people say things like that, I just take it with, you know, some you know, just think as face value, thank you. But even that in and of itself is kind of offensive. It's like you're impressed because you because I'm more than what you expected I would be. That's offensive. And you’re in your mind so just to connect it to the conversation about race. In your mind, that expectation, like, where else could it come from other than the color of your skin is the way you, I'm assuming, feel about it. Like Yes. That there aren't other signals. There aren't other signals that would have led him to a different set of expectations that the best theory of why he has that expectation is signal of the color of your Who walks up to a white man and say, I'm so impressed with you. Who walks up to a white dude and says that no. You wanna know why? Because white men are expected to be impressed. Mhmm. They say it again. There we go, baby. Yes. So you talked you said what I'm seeing, meaning what I'm seeing in right leaning media, what I'm seeing in left leaning media, they create a narrative of takers, of lazy, of people who only need to the handouts of, and so it was in the present. And I'm just curious, when did you start being aware or taking in or seeing or and responding to the way that the black, I could answer your question. Was represented. Is this something you saw from early? Is this some something later? Happened during the pre it happened during a certain presidency in the nineties. Is when I started to really because I we're talking in the vein of politics, was when I really started to understand the way black people were being approached by politicians, crafted by politicians, and how it has influenced democratic leaning thinking of mine. And I recognize that in the nineties, you know, a certain presidency inculcated me to a certain line of thinking. And but at the same time, for, you know, the strides or the benefits that, you know, black people can glean from the, you know, as their right as their right from the government as being citizens. It for us, it's cast in a way that we are somehow depleting the country of its resources, and not contributing to the country's fair share of what GDP, GMP, I mean, you know So this is, so this was the welfare conversation, or this was the I mean, if you're talking about economics, it's not the crime conversation. I'm assuming it's Both. It's actually both. I was trying to avoid names, but yeah. It was it's both. So the tough on crime and the tough on the accountability for welfare and welfare queens and single mother. How do you know that terms? So that whole conversation is the conversation when you first started to take in this this perception. Yes. It's how it's not this this, presentation of the black community as Yes. Okay. Yes. Right around the time of being 13 years old. Thank you for watching this Thank you for watching this episode of Healing Race and stay with us for a scene from our next video. If you wanna see more conversations like the one you just watched, please subscribe to our channel, share this video with friends and family, and like and comment on the video below. If you'd like to be a guest on one of our episodes and have an open real conversation about race, email us at guests at healingracehow.com. And if there are topics you think we should cover, we'd love to hear them. So please email your ideas to topics at healingraceshow.com. As always, thanks for your support. We look forward to continuing the conversation with you. Now, here's a scene from our next healing race. So let's listen quickly. Let's take that up and see if there's any other conversations because you did mention the, like, you know, white means right idea. No, I didn't mention it. I said, and white dudes always think they know everything. Ask white women, they'll tell you. They're like, they do. They always know everything. Well, why don't we just jump into the conversation because another thing you brought up another thing you brought up in that clip, in in in that episode was the second thing beyond that you have heart as a community, that you have wisdom as a community. Yes. And I guess how do you what does it look like? Because I don’t, I don't know what it what it looks like. Right? What does it look like to know that you're like, how do you know that your views are being discounted because of race? And what does that even look like? Like, what's the experience? To watch the rest of that episode, go ahead and click the video below me. To see a different compelling Healing Race episode, you can click the video below me. We look forward to seeing you in the next video.